Real Traditional Spey rod

[speyman]

Friends,
I`m interested in buy one Traditional Spey rod for use only with traditional style.
What you think is the best rod and lines for that?
Thank you.

[corribspeycaster]

The best are carron followed by robert gillespies turas custom , an incredible rod if you want more details let me know, they are wonderful fishing and casting tolls deisgned by one of the best. no frills or gimmicks just a very powerful progressive spey casting rod that launches a carron line a country mile and equally good with a shooting head.

[Editor]

I was lucky enough to have a cast with the new (actually not out yet) Hardy Sintrix 15ft 1in double hander last week and it was superb. Powerful yet responsive and progressive - certainly no poker and easy to cast with.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'traditional' though? I hope you dont mean dumping lots of line in the water in a heap and bullying it out! :-)

Was that not the traditional way?

Personally I prefer the Trevor Morgan Javelin to the Carrons.

Cheers

Colin

[corribspeycaster]

javelin is a good line but not a traditional long belly or even mid, if the casters skill is high enough there should be no dumping of a lot line in the water, i can manage a 75 foot head waist deep or higher in fast water, short lines have their uses but on a large river from late spring until early summer 65 plus spey lines are a joy to use, they are also the only way to develop true technique for use with any system, if you stay with short lines it is harder to learn how to handle mid or long bellies, if i need a short line it is normally for sunk line fishing in which case I would use my tay/tummel shooting heads cut to about 50 foot, the javelin is a good line if you prefer short heads.
If anyone would like to try next cast spey lines on a free trial they can pm me.
i have the following that they can borrow.
They are excellent.
WinterAuthority70-10/11 head - 870grain at 70feet - works very well
with 14'6" and up rods
WinterAuthority55-10/11 full line - 880 grain at 60feet - works very
well with 14' and up rods
WinterAuthority45-10/11 head - 760grain at 52feet - works very well
with 14' or 15' rods
FallFavorite45-9/10 head - 700grain at 49feet - works very well with
14' or 15' rods
FallFavorite70-9/10 head - 790grains at 68feet - works very well with
14'6" and up rods
CHAMP1516 () i will ask for this cut to about that length for distance casting people

[Editor]

javelin is a good line but not a traditional long belly or even mid, if the casters skill is high enough there should be no dumping of a lot line in the water, i can manage a 75 foot head waist deep or higher in fast water, short lines have their uses but on a large river from late spring until early summer 65 plus spey lines are a joy to use, they are also the only way to develop true technique for use with any system, if you stay with short lines it is harder to learn how to handle mid or long bellies, if i need a short line it is normally for sunk line fishing in which case I would use my tay/tummel shooting heads cut to about 50 foot, the javelin is a good line if you prefer short heads.
If anyone would like to try next cast spey lines on a free trial they can pm me.
i have the following that they can borrow.

Hi Corrib,
I would not thank you for a 75ft head. I have watched spey casters struggle with their casting the world over! Why? because they are trying to aerialise 65 or 75ft heads - as have been recommended to them by some shop.

The upshot is that they lay too much line on the water and cannot get it back out again. And especially so if they are deep wading – which people unwisely do – especially when they can’t reach where they want to – so they move closer. A nightmare scenario but all too common.

It is little wonder that short Skagit lines have become so popular – they are simply much easier to cast. (Although personally I find them clunky/brutal – and don’t like them much).

Even in talented casting hands there are very few rivers wide enough and easy enough to wade (with plenty of room behind) that allow a full head to be worked.

I once discussed this with an experienced angler who swore by 75ft heads – so we met up and had a very interesting session. It transpired that he brought the thick end of the head all the way to his reel. In other words he shaved 15ft off the head to start with! Which meant of course he was really fishing with a 60ft head! I wonder how many 75 footers do this 

Let’s also look at cast length. I suggest that a 30 yard cast {90ft}. (from person to fly) is long enough to fish with anywhere in the world. At that length, or less, you can easily maintain control over the fly – the cast should be basically effortless and a joy to perform. Yet far enough to reach almost anywhere – effectively.

So let look at that in more detail.

Rod = 15ft.
Leader 13ft (including poly-tip if used).

We have already reached 28ft out of 90ft!

So that leaves another 62 ft to find.

In fishing situations, at the end of each cast, we bring in about 10ft of line that we will shoot. This fishes the fly in an attractive manner late in the cast, breaks the surface tension and helps lift the fly a little in the water column.

Ok that leaves us 52 ft of head. Perfect! And that is really very easily manageable even by weekenders.

Why, therefore would I ever want to use anything longer than a 50ft head? Well I can tell you I dont 


To summarise.

10ft in hand {ready to shoot}. OPTIONAL
15ft within rod
52ft head
13ft leader.

= 80ft to 90ft (30 yards)

So what happens when we change to a 75ft head (in the hands of a pro).

10ft in hand {ready to shoot}. OPTIONAL
15ft within rod
75ft head
13ft leader.

= 103 to 113ft (38 yards)

Does anyone really fish the fly that far away?

[williegunn]

So what happens when we change to a 75ft head (in the hands of a pro).

10ft in hand {ready to shoot}. OPTIONAL
15ft within rod
75ft head
13ft leader.

= 103 to 113ft (38 yards)

Does anyone really fish the fly that far away?

Yes, constantly, I use the Carron 85, with the colour change arond the rod tip.
You should get yourself up to the Ness or Lower Spey. I might have a space on the Ness next year.

[imported_cb]

i can manage a 75 foot head waist deep or higher in fast water

Hi Corrib,

This is impressive - very few can! Question, do you hold you hands above your head when you do this?

And do you not find the rod really struggling with the 'grip' of the water when you try and lift the line off? Or are you using a line that is quite 'light' for the rod?

Cheers

Colin

[imported_cb]

Yes, constantly, I use the Carron 85

Hi WG,

You must have back muscles like Big Daddy and a rod like Bruce and Walker on speed :-)

Thanks for the invite on the Ness - I have fished it a couple of times - well at least my side of it. The other half was easily fished - from a boat ;-)

85ft + 13ft (how long is your leader-rig?) + 10ft (shooting - do you shoot?) + 15ft rod = 123ft !! (41 yards)

You surely dont use that rig on middle-Spey? You'll be hitting WM on the nose!

Cheers

Colin

[williegunn]

Hi WG,

You must have back muscles like Big Daddy and a rod like Bruce and Walker on speed :-)

No it is all in the technique, make both hands work, that's why its a two handed rod.

Thanks for the invite on the Ness - I have fished it a couple of times - well at least my side of it. The other half was easily fished - from a boat ;-)

A boat in the Little Isle, Mill Stream or McIntyre, that would cause somewhat of a scene

85ft + 13ft (how long is your leader-rig?) + 10ft (shooting - do you shoot?) + 15ft rod = 123ft !! (41 yards)


Cheers

Colin

Yes I shoot, couple of rods lengths, cannot stand having yards of running line all around me, unless stripping a collie dog or something similar.

[corribspeycaster]

Hi Corrib,

This is impressive - very few can! Question, do you hold you hands above your head when you do this?

And do you not find the rod really struggling with the 'grip' of the water when you try and lift the line off? Or are you using a line that is quite 'light' for the rod?

Cheers

Colin

The system of spey casting I use is call fulcrum fly casting used by many of the carron team and other top fly casters the world over, the line i use is a carron 9/10 which are heavy for their line rating closer to a 10 /11 by any other manufacturer, if proper mechanics of this system are used there should be no problem lifting and casting a 75 foot head or longer spey line whilst wading, the top hand remains as the fulrum, the only thing that differs is the stroke length the longer the line the longer the stroke, the rod spring needs to be fully compressed and well back as that is where a beginner would struggle with a long line, once the casting cycle is understood and correct stroke length and power application is applied true spey casting technique is developed, once this is obtained the transition to any line system is simple, but it is a terrible thing to watch some fishing a short heavy line down a pool with poor technique, also many people are unable to manage the extra running line with some very short head lines. 65 foot lines make a very good option for any one learning and are certainly easiliy managed, if there is too much still within the casting cycle any line will fail.
There is a excellent clips on you tube look up either andrew toft or robert gillespie the latter explains fulcrum flycasting brilliantly two of the best casters in the world.